You.
I look at you.
Him. So near to me.
But these eyes turn back to you. <br>
The war begins, as usual.
Head and the heart battle it out.
Who will win?
The beating of one's soul, of course. <br>
You make me burn.
He soothes me after.
Your eyes pierce through my soul, leaving me bare and naked.
Fitting all the lost pieces together till you know me like the air you breathe.
His eyes skim the surface, looking for the best parts of me.
He makes me want to be. Be that person he thinks I am. That person I know i can be.
But you see me for what I really am. <br>
Your charm is like a magnet.
Too strong for anyone to resist.
No one's even trying to.
You pull out people's deepest pains and sorrows that's burried and hidden <br>
Effortlessly.
You do it so effortlessly. <br>
Im in awe because you fascinate me,
you amaze me,
you captivate me.
But you're wrong for me.
The head and the whole world seems to think so.
But my heart.
Oh, my heart.
It screams and wails and yells
that you're right. Too right for me.
Thursday, July 26, 2012
Saturday, July 21, 2012
I feel so much sadness tonight. I understand that too much time alone with my thoughts leads me to a dark place. There's this darkness & evil within myself that I need to defeat (no blaming on shaitan since its ramadhan). This I think is gonna be my biggest challenge of yet.
I almost "died" inside tonight during solat when I was thinking whether me questioning god's existence is bordering on shirik (which is the most unforgivable sin) which makes me worse than any murderer or rapist or thief in this earth. A person who murders out of mischief is said to have murdered the whole human race. Even he would have the chance of Allah's forgiveness, But I'm worse than that. I felt so ashamed. So dumb, so stupid, so ungrateful. I didn't feel like lifting my face off the floor of the masjid during sujud because I felt so ashamed to face my creator. For ever having that ounce of doubt after I'm blessed left, right, centre.
With that conclusion, I'm not gonna give up. I'm gonna continuosly try and acheive his rahmah and please him. I'm gonna keep trying and ask for forgiveness. I'm gonna pray and worship him even though I know the chance of him forgiving him might be negligible, because thats my purpose on this earth- to worship and praise him. And yet today, I read this ayah in Surah Ad-Dhuha that says he does not forsake you. And my fav line that "on no soul does Allah place a greater burden than he can bear". So im convinvced that I can overcome this chip in my aqidah and come out victorious, InsyaAllah.
I'll spend my life doing good deeds, or die trying. Because I need it to repent for my sins. And If I can make one life easier, why not? And to please Allah swt with my actions, if he wills it.
What a slice of humble pie, like Taufiq told me "Compliments should make you more humble." I understand it now. When someone says "wow you're so kind", you shouldn't accept the compliment as yours because kindness is Allah swt's gift to you. And all praises be to Alllah. Furthermore, aren't we supposed to be kind? (we're not even near emulating the prophet saw)
So bottom line, I've decided not to take philosophy because I'm weak. I wanted to take philosophy to challenge myself and perharps, help those having the same questions to the right path. But I realise, i'm not the right person to do that. Because I'm weak. So much so. I would rather not risk Allah's wrath than lead a few people to the right path. We have to think for ourselves when the push comes to shove.
Also, like what wee leong told me, the inception theory. How true. Its fate that he said that to me. All part of allah's plan that i have to learn to accept. For he is all-knowing.
Ya Allah, only you can grant me forgiveness, may you place me among the believers. Insya Allah. Ameen.
I almost "died" inside tonight during solat when I was thinking whether me questioning god's existence is bordering on shirik (which is the most unforgivable sin) which makes me worse than any murderer or rapist or thief in this earth. A person who murders out of mischief is said to have murdered the whole human race. Even he would have the chance of Allah's forgiveness, But I'm worse than that. I felt so ashamed. So dumb, so stupid, so ungrateful. I didn't feel like lifting my face off the floor of the masjid during sujud because I felt so ashamed to face my creator. For ever having that ounce of doubt after I'm blessed left, right, centre.
With that conclusion, I'm not gonna give up. I'm gonna continuosly try and acheive his rahmah and please him. I'm gonna keep trying and ask for forgiveness. I'm gonna pray and worship him even though I know the chance of him forgiving him might be negligible, because thats my purpose on this earth- to worship and praise him. And yet today, I read this ayah in Surah Ad-Dhuha that says he does not forsake you. And my fav line that "on no soul does Allah place a greater burden than he can bear". So im convinvced that I can overcome this chip in my aqidah and come out victorious, InsyaAllah.
I'll spend my life doing good deeds, or die trying. Because I need it to repent for my sins. And If I can make one life easier, why not? And to please Allah swt with my actions, if he wills it.
What a slice of humble pie, like Taufiq told me "Compliments should make you more humble." I understand it now. When someone says "wow you're so kind", you shouldn't accept the compliment as yours because kindness is Allah swt's gift to you. And all praises be to Alllah. Furthermore, aren't we supposed to be kind? (we're not even near emulating the prophet saw)
So bottom line, I've decided not to take philosophy because I'm weak. I wanted to take philosophy to challenge myself and perharps, help those having the same questions to the right path. But I realise, i'm not the right person to do that. Because I'm weak. So much so. I would rather not risk Allah's wrath than lead a few people to the right path. We have to think for ourselves when the push comes to shove.
Also, like what wee leong told me, the inception theory. How true. Its fate that he said that to me. All part of allah's plan that i have to learn to accept. For he is all-knowing.
Ya Allah, only you can grant me forgiveness, may you place me among the believers. Insya Allah. Ameen.
Thursday, July 5, 2012
I remember one time, I was with her in a mall, and I saw this really cool action figure of some sort--something that I've been looking for quite a while. This really feels uncomfortable because it's so uncool to buy an action figure while I was with an ENFJ chick.
She'd eventually say, "My ex is a toy collector." :)
The statement just made me comfortable. I don't know if she deliberately said that because she was able to sense the awkwardness of the situation, or if it's also an indirect statement from her that I can just be myself when I'm with her.
That's a trademark ENFJ trait. They're so good in making subtle open-ended remarks that can easily be romanticized or interpreted the way you enjoy it. But at the same time, you don't wanna get too pushy with your interpretation because you'll never know what she really meant. It's not as if she's overwhelming you with affection. It's just that she's so damn good in making open ended subtle flirtations.
Maybe that's the way she enjoys it. The basic premise, "You can get close to me, but have a sense of distance". The problem is the distance is so vague it becomes an addictive flirting loop.
She'd eventually say, "My ex is a toy collector." :)
The statement just made me comfortable. I don't know if she deliberately said that because she was able to sense the awkwardness of the situation, or if it's also an indirect statement from her that I can just be myself when I'm with her.
That's a trademark ENFJ trait. They're so good in making subtle open-ended remarks that can easily be romanticized or interpreted the way you enjoy it. But at the same time, you don't wanna get too pushy with your interpretation because you'll never know what she really meant. It's not as if she's overwhelming you with affection. It's just that she's so damn good in making open ended subtle flirtations.
Maybe that's the way she enjoys it. The basic premise, "You can get close to me, but have a sense of distance". The problem is the distance is so vague it becomes an addictive flirting loop.
Fits to a T
One of my best friends is an INFP and I wish I could find the guy version of her. I love that she understands my feelings because she has deep feelings too. We both also are a little dreamy, so we understand each other in that way... I think it is the N thing.
I love INFPs! I really respect that my friend needs alone time but I feel so honored when she allows me just to hang out with her, because I find her presence very calming, even if she needs "alone time" and we don't talk. She listens to my ideas and offers honest feedback. she also is always ready to go on adventures with me. yeah, INFPs are awesome.
I love INFPs! I really respect that my friend needs alone time but I feel so honored when she allows me just to hang out with her, because I find her presence very calming, even if she needs "alone time" and we don't talk. She listens to my ideas and offers honest feedback. she also is always ready to go on adventures with me. yeah, INFPs are awesome.
Monday, July 2, 2012
ENFj + ESTp (Socionics)
Relations of Activity
These relations are the easiest and quickest to start. Activity partners do not experience any visual difficulties when starting relations which can be surprising to them at the beginning. Partners stimulate each other into activity. Interaction with an Activity partner becomes really satisfying especially if both partners feel a mutual attraction. However, with continuous interaction over a long period comes overactivation which normally results in an overall tiredness of each other (a good example is when you watch a comedy that is so funny that after half the film you do not have the energy to laugh anymore). When this happens Activity partners need a short rest from each other, after which they can enjoy a positive interaction once again. This pattern repeats itself giving these relations an oscillating character. If partners cannot take a break from each other, it can cause negative stimulation to take the place of positive.
Although overall interaction between partners is nice and easy, when it comes to fulfilling everyday duties and matters together, partners usually meet with many problems. Instead of solving the problems, Activity partners tend to give advice to each other on how to solve these problems, often affecting each others weak points. The advice of an Activity partner is always useful as it can strengthen your weakness, but not so much that it will ever become your strength.
The other problem with these relations is that information between Activity partners always needs some adjustments. One partner may think of it as too foggy and not concrete enough, whereas for the other partner it is too unrefined. Collaboration is also difficult, because partners cannot predict each others behaviour and actions in what seem to be ordinary situations. Because of this, partners cannot rely or count on each other in full. Most of the problems that arise during Activity relationships are because one partner is always Perceiving and the other is always Judging, meaning that they live in different life rhythms.
These relations are excellent for leisure, but not for day to day activities. When two Duality pairs gather together (forming a complete Quadrable) they experience a feeling of elation. The reason for this is that when two Duality pairs interact with each other, the two introverts (one from each Duality pair) and the two extroverts (again, one from each Duality pair) interact with each other as relations of Activity. Introverts in relations of Activity become slightly extroverted and more open, whereas two extroverts will often calm down a little.
These relations are the easiest and quickest to start. Activity partners do not experience any visual difficulties when starting relations which can be surprising to them at the beginning. Partners stimulate each other into activity. Interaction with an Activity partner becomes really satisfying especially if both partners feel a mutual attraction. However, with continuous interaction over a long period comes overactivation which normally results in an overall tiredness of each other (a good example is when you watch a comedy that is so funny that after half the film you do not have the energy to laugh anymore). When this happens Activity partners need a short rest from each other, after which they can enjoy a positive interaction once again. This pattern repeats itself giving these relations an oscillating character. If partners cannot take a break from each other, it can cause negative stimulation to take the place of positive.
Although overall interaction between partners is nice and easy, when it comes to fulfilling everyday duties and matters together, partners usually meet with many problems. Instead of solving the problems, Activity partners tend to give advice to each other on how to solve these problems, often affecting each others weak points. The advice of an Activity partner is always useful as it can strengthen your weakness, but not so much that it will ever become your strength.
The other problem with these relations is that information between Activity partners always needs some adjustments. One partner may think of it as too foggy and not concrete enough, whereas for the other partner it is too unrefined. Collaboration is also difficult, because partners cannot predict each others behaviour and actions in what seem to be ordinary situations. Because of this, partners cannot rely or count on each other in full. Most of the problems that arise during Activity relationships are because one partner is always Perceiving and the other is always Judging, meaning that they live in different life rhythms.
These relations are excellent for leisure, but not for day to day activities. When two Duality pairs gather together (forming a complete Quadrable) they experience a feeling of elation. The reason for this is that when two Duality pairs interact with each other, the two introverts (one from each Duality pair) and the two extroverts (again, one from each Duality pair) interact with each other as relations of Activity. Introverts in relations of Activity become slightly extroverted and more open, whereas two extroverts will often calm down a little.
Wednesday, June 20, 2012
Why i think G is a ESTP 6w7
I think he's the same type as Sa. They seem to be very similar, yet differnt. I take their differences to be due to the enneagram. I think Sa is an 8 and G a 6, explaining a certain softness to him as compared to sa.
As an ESTP, your primary mode of living is focused externally, where you take things in via your five senses in a literal, concrete fashion. Your secondary mode is internal, where you deal with things rationally and logically.
He's first function is Se, which makes a lot of sense since Al is Se too. And he seems very rational and logical although you have to really observe him to take note of these sort of things.
ESTPs are outgoing, straight-shooting types. Enthusiastic and excitable, ESTPs are "doers" who live in the world of action. Blunt, straight-forward risk-takers, they are willing to plunge right into things and get their hands dirty. They live in the here-and-now, and place little importance on introspection or theory. The look at the facts of a situation, quickly decide what should be done, execute the action, and move on to the next thing.
Explains his need to have a lot of activities, 4 camps, make friends, be in a different cliques. Its different from my own motives - which is that people interest me and i wanted to connect with people from different groups. His is more of excitement. So as not to be bored. New experiences. Total SP-ish. And during the career test, he did say he liked to be hands on and do things outdoor.
ESTPs have an uncanny ability to perceive people's attitudes and motivations. They pick up on little cues which go completely unnoticed by most other types, such as facial expressions and stance. They're typically a couple of steps ahead of the person they're interacting with. ESTPs use this ability to get what they want out of a situation.
This. No wonder he's pretty up to par with my game. I've always felt so. Even since the day at Fish & Co. even when i knew him less than a week?
They love to have fun, and are fun people to be around. They can sometimes be hurtful to others without being aware of it, as they generally do not know and may not care about the effect their words have on others. It's not that they don't care about people, it's that their decision-making process does not involve taking people's feelings into account. They make decisions based on facts and logic.
Yup, the way he was acting with me yestrday on whatsapp was quite hurtful, yet at the same time i don't think he means to hurt me.
ESTP's least developed area is their intuitive side. They are impatient with theory, and see little use for it in their quest to "get things done". An ESTP will occasionally have strong intuitions which are often way off-base, but sometimes very lucid and positive. The ESTP does not trust their instincts, and is suspicious of other people's intuition as well.
The ESTP is not likely to choose to be around all of the personality types. They have little patience for iNtuitive Thinking types, who seem very abstract and theoretical to the ESTP, who values action. The ESTP is likely to choose to be around people who have similar interests to their own - such as sports-oriented interests.
Hahaha, im not surprised. My second function, which i must say is quite developed now is Introverted Intuition. No wonder he's so....nyurgh....when i go all abstract or random.
As an ESTP, your primary mode of living is focused externally, where you take things in via your five senses in a literal, concrete fashion. Your secondary mode is internal, where you deal with things rationally and logically.
He's first function is Se, which makes a lot of sense since Al is Se too. And he seems very rational and logical although you have to really observe him to take note of these sort of things.
ESTPs are outgoing, straight-shooting types. Enthusiastic and excitable, ESTPs are "doers" who live in the world of action. Blunt, straight-forward risk-takers, they are willing to plunge right into things and get their hands dirty. They live in the here-and-now, and place little importance on introspection or theory. The look at the facts of a situation, quickly decide what should be done, execute the action, and move on to the next thing.
Explains his need to have a lot of activities, 4 camps, make friends, be in a different cliques. Its different from my own motives - which is that people interest me and i wanted to connect with people from different groups. His is more of excitement. So as not to be bored. New experiences. Total SP-ish. And during the career test, he did say he liked to be hands on and do things outdoor.
ESTPs have an uncanny ability to perceive people's attitudes and motivations. They pick up on little cues which go completely unnoticed by most other types, such as facial expressions and stance. They're typically a couple of steps ahead of the person they're interacting with. ESTPs use this ability to get what they want out of a situation.
This. No wonder he's pretty up to par with my game. I've always felt so. Even since the day at Fish & Co. even when i knew him less than a week?
They love to have fun, and are fun people to be around. They can sometimes be hurtful to others without being aware of it, as they generally do not know and may not care about the effect their words have on others. It's not that they don't care about people, it's that their decision-making process does not involve taking people's feelings into account. They make decisions based on facts and logic.
Yup, the way he was acting with me yestrday on whatsapp was quite hurtful, yet at the same time i don't think he means to hurt me.
ESTP's least developed area is their intuitive side. They are impatient with theory, and see little use for it in their quest to "get things done". An ESTP will occasionally have strong intuitions which are often way off-base, but sometimes very lucid and positive. The ESTP does not trust their instincts, and is suspicious of other people's intuition as well.
The ESTP is not likely to choose to be around all of the personality types. They have little patience for iNtuitive Thinking types, who seem very abstract and theoretical to the ESTP, who values action. The ESTP is likely to choose to be around people who have similar interests to their own - such as sports-oriented interests.
Hahaha, im not surprised. My second function, which i must say is quite developed now is Introverted Intuition. No wonder he's so....nyurgh....when i go all abstract or random.
ENFJ + ESTP
Lol, story of me and G:
In my experience, ENFJs take words very personally (hence my warning). If an ENFJ could expect the ESTP to sometimes be very sharp and hurtful without meaning to be, then the ENFJ might be able to slough it off like water off a duck's back. Otherwise, the ENFJ MIGHT feel attacked by this ESTP trait, and try to attack back. But as I said earlier, if they do this, if the ENFJ tries to attack BACK, that's when the ESTP will cut them to shreds with a few well placed words/phrases (or worse). So I recommend the ENFJ avoid this at all costs.
The problem is that when ESTPs are used to someone they will let lots of harsh things out, and if you're an ENFJ you will get massively defensive when an "attack" is perceived. For an ESTP that kinda thing happens all the time and isn't really personal. The ENFJ will make it personal. The ENFJ may have lots of good insults stored up, but the ESTP will always make the final cut, and the ESTP will NOT tolerate an emotional blowout time and again. Once the ENFJ gets emotional and angry the ESTP will be outta there.
I continue to say this, because of the seriousness of ENFJ/ESTP rage (in different ways).
Whoever is with an ESTP should be pretty unflappable. It's not that the ENFJ won't be able to to attack back, the ENFJ attacking back IS THE PROBLEM.
So im supposed to take his accusations of me hiding things and being manipulative lying down?
I'd say just make sure not to take things personally. But upfront; don't play any passive-aggressive games, ESTPs don't like that very much. And also be prepared; an ESTP will probably be in-your-face a lot, and sometimes they will exhaust you. Make sure you set up boundaries so you can take a break if you need it, and don't get too defensive or moody, or else you will make them moody as well. And ESTPs can get quite moody if you press the right buttons.
What I meant is that if an ESTP feels attacked they will either leave or destroy the other person with a well chosen word/phrase that cuts worse than the ENFJ (or any type on the receiving end) can imagine. I can't explain why this happens, only that it does and that it might have something to do with the ESTPs hawk-like instincts and alarming charisma.
If you haven't had this experience it is likely that you have never truly attacked an ESTP.
Sigh. Happened to me. Something about how im always hiding and my lies..... Totally killed me, that one. I didnt know anyone who could read me so well....but in the most callous way too... It's like my worst fear coming true.
ENFJ can cut back plenty hard, so don't underestimate them. ENFJs wonderful gifts can just as easily be misused to devastate. The problem is, even if ENFJ attacks with a death blow worthy comeback, it won't matter much. The ESTP, if so motivated, is always willing to raise the stakes and keep on playing. Call it a mutually assured destruction.
Startle an ENFJ and they will whip around in their chair ready to fight (seriously). Startle an SP and they will be startled, period. By pouring emotion into everything, the ENFJ is putting themselves at a disadvantage in a fight, because they are draining themselves in a situation that doesn't call for at outpouring of emotion like that (in many cases).
So how do i get less drained? exactly what i was thinking last night. That i was feeling drained. So...one is to take breaks (like the times i would just ignore him). Two, dont be emotional. Dont take it personally. Try.
First strategy is to avoid, which usually works most of the time. But I felt like they were seeking me out to start drama on purpose.
Feels so..why?? Why do i attract drama? i hate dramaaa.
I think I get what you're saying that for them it was always fun and games, but I guess I don't see it that way. I see it as their way of being in control of their environment and the people in it which if the need is strong enough is actually a weakness. I've never viewed ESTPs as being as easygoing as they're portrayed, I've always thought they were very sharp, perceptive, and dominant people.
That is interesting, to say the least. My first impression of him was that he's so easy-going and very adaptable. Like he would be okay in any social situation, something i admired. Because he seems to blend in every environment....well i'll feel like an awkward turtle. But after much more interaction, i realise his exactly that - very sharp, perceptive, dominant. He did say he had sharp eyes, why did i doubt him? Now to think of it, Sa is something similar altogether. I know her as perceptive and potentially dominant....but to the outsider she's very easy going. And i've never been on the receiving end of her wrath.
I honestly dont know if i can get along with G anymore, i'll try for Al's sake. But now there's a certain sort of weariness and resentment in me. I think its mutual tho... In group situations, i have to tread carefully and pretend like nothing happened. How'd it get so serious?
It seems to me that if you fall into their pack (probably stemming from tertiary Fe) you're cool and protected but if not, you're poked and prodded until some reason is found.
Yea ok, makes sense. He's trying to suss me out and see if im trustworthy? I hate thissss.
The trick with ESTPs is to not play their game. Simply comment on how whatever they just said as interesting or unique and ask for their opinion on it. I always keep a smile on my face as well :> When you appear interested in what they have to say I think it throws them a bit off balance.
Interesting. So always...play along and act dumb??
Now ENFJ's, wow, those guys can manipulate the hell out of you if you don't see it coming. Their tendency to always say the right thing combined with the fact that they are able to make every interaction they have seem secretive makes them master manipulators. In my experience, they tend to be extremely two-faced and can turn the whole world against you if you are not prepared. I actually enjoy spending time with them due to the fact that with an ENFJ on my side, I can manipulate the entire world. If one is around, they usually pick up on what I'm trying to get out of the person I'm manipulating and help me accomplish my objective. They are great for collaboration. ENFJ's manipulate people to move themselves forward socially, they also tend not to see what they are doing as manipulation.
ESTP's can manipulate you to a certain point, usually though, their "say anything at anytime" nature gets the better of them and they wind up shooting themselves in the foot. It seems like they would also rather not be around people they don't like, even if given the chance to manipulate them. They are great at manipulating their friends though.ESTP's manipulate their friends in order to get what they want out of them(usually money, or that expensive watch you just bought).
In my experience, ENFJs take words very personally (hence my warning). If an ENFJ could expect the ESTP to sometimes be very sharp and hurtful without meaning to be, then the ENFJ might be able to slough it off like water off a duck's back. Otherwise, the ENFJ MIGHT feel attacked by this ESTP trait, and try to attack back. But as I said earlier, if they do this, if the ENFJ tries to attack BACK, that's when the ESTP will cut them to shreds with a few well placed words/phrases (or worse). So I recommend the ENFJ avoid this at all costs.
The problem is that when ESTPs are used to someone they will let lots of harsh things out, and if you're an ENFJ you will get massively defensive when an "attack" is perceived. For an ESTP that kinda thing happens all the time and isn't really personal. The ENFJ will make it personal. The ENFJ may have lots of good insults stored up, but the ESTP will always make the final cut, and the ESTP will NOT tolerate an emotional blowout time and again. Once the ENFJ gets emotional and angry the ESTP will be outta there.
I continue to say this, because of the seriousness of ENFJ/ESTP rage (in different ways).
Whoever is with an ESTP should be pretty unflappable. It's not that the ENFJ won't be able to to attack back, the ENFJ attacking back IS THE PROBLEM.
So im supposed to take his accusations of me hiding things and being manipulative lying down?
I'd say just make sure not to take things personally. But upfront; don't play any passive-aggressive games, ESTPs don't like that very much. And also be prepared; an ESTP will probably be in-your-face a lot, and sometimes they will exhaust you. Make sure you set up boundaries so you can take a break if you need it, and don't get too defensive or moody, or else you will make them moody as well. And ESTPs can get quite moody if you press the right buttons.
What I meant is that if an ESTP feels attacked they will either leave or destroy the other person with a well chosen word/phrase that cuts worse than the ENFJ (or any type on the receiving end) can imagine. I can't explain why this happens, only that it does and that it might have something to do with the ESTPs hawk-like instincts and alarming charisma.
If you haven't had this experience it is likely that you have never truly attacked an ESTP.
Sigh. Happened to me. Something about how im always hiding and my lies..... Totally killed me, that one. I didnt know anyone who could read me so well....but in the most callous way too... It's like my worst fear coming true.
ENFJ can cut back plenty hard, so don't underestimate them. ENFJs wonderful gifts can just as easily be misused to devastate. The problem is, even if ENFJ attacks with a death blow worthy comeback, it won't matter much. The ESTP, if so motivated, is always willing to raise the stakes and keep on playing. Call it a mutually assured destruction.
Startle an ENFJ and they will whip around in their chair ready to fight (seriously). Startle an SP and they will be startled, period. By pouring emotion into everything, the ENFJ is putting themselves at a disadvantage in a fight, because they are draining themselves in a situation that doesn't call for at outpouring of emotion like that (in many cases).
So how do i get less drained? exactly what i was thinking last night. That i was feeling drained. So...one is to take breaks (like the times i would just ignore him). Two, dont be emotional. Dont take it personally. Try.
First strategy is to avoid, which usually works most of the time. But I felt like they were seeking me out to start drama on purpose.
Feels so..why?? Why do i attract drama? i hate dramaaa.
I think I get what you're saying that for them it was always fun and games, but I guess I don't see it that way. I see it as their way of being in control of their environment and the people in it which if the need is strong enough is actually a weakness. I've never viewed ESTPs as being as easygoing as they're portrayed, I've always thought they were very sharp, perceptive, and dominant people.
That is interesting, to say the least. My first impression of him was that he's so easy-going and very adaptable. Like he would be okay in any social situation, something i admired. Because he seems to blend in every environment....well i'll feel like an awkward turtle. But after much more interaction, i realise his exactly that - very sharp, perceptive, dominant. He did say he had sharp eyes, why did i doubt him? Now to think of it, Sa is something similar altogether. I know her as perceptive and potentially dominant....but to the outsider she's very easy going. And i've never been on the receiving end of her wrath.
I honestly dont know if i can get along with G anymore, i'll try for Al's sake. But now there's a certain sort of weariness and resentment in me. I think its mutual tho... In group situations, i have to tread carefully and pretend like nothing happened. How'd it get so serious?
It seems to me that if you fall into their pack (probably stemming from tertiary Fe) you're cool and protected but if not, you're poked and prodded until some reason is found.
Yea ok, makes sense. He's trying to suss me out and see if im trustworthy? I hate thissss.
The trick with ESTPs is to not play their game. Simply comment on how whatever they just said as interesting or unique and ask for their opinion on it. I always keep a smile on my face as well :> When you appear interested in what they have to say I think it throws them a bit off balance.
Interesting. So always...play along and act dumb??
Now ENFJ's, wow, those guys can manipulate the hell out of you if you don't see it coming. Their tendency to always say the right thing combined with the fact that they are able to make every interaction they have seem secretive makes them master manipulators. In my experience, they tend to be extremely two-faced and can turn the whole world against you if you are not prepared. I actually enjoy spending time with them due to the fact that with an ENFJ on my side, I can manipulate the entire world. If one is around, they usually pick up on what I'm trying to get out of the person I'm manipulating and help me accomplish my objective. They are great for collaboration. ENFJ's manipulate people to move themselves forward socially, they also tend not to see what they are doing as manipulation.
ESTP's can manipulate you to a certain point, usually though, their "say anything at anytime" nature gets the better of them and they wind up shooting themselves in the foot. It seems like they would also rather not be around people they don't like, even if given the chance to manipulate them. They are great at manipulating their friends though.ESTP's manipulate their friends in order to get what they want out of them(usually money, or that expensive watch you just bought).
Thursday, June 14, 2012
Low self-esteem
I've been taking a closer look at my inner-self and I'm realizing that a ton of my issues stem from low self-esteem. If I think about it there is no reason for me to not be confident in myself but its my natural tendency. Example: if a friend makes a skeptical face after I say something it affects me WAY more than it should. I'm wondering if it is common for ENFJs to suffer from low self-esteem, how other ENFJs have dealt with it, and if it has gotten better with age.
Another quirk about me: I don't form extremely close relationships often. Over the course of my life I have had one "best" friend. (Best friend meaning someone I show my whole self to, someone I am completely comfortable with.) I think this might relate to me not being confident enough in myself to let people in. This is not to say I don't have any friends. I have tons of friends, and really good ones that trust me a lot; I just don't give my whole self to them.
About the close friendships thing. I am the same way. I am very picky about who I "let in." I read that ENFJ's tend to hide their "true selves" from people...even though we can share quite a lot. When I read this, I tried to little by little share some secrets with certain friends who I trust more, just to see how they would respond. When they accept these secrets, I feel relieved and feel like my trust in them deepens and that our relationship gets closer. It does feel a little nerve-wracking at first, but when they respond well to it then I think it is really worth it. If they don't respond well, then...I start to question how far the relationship will go. I want friends who can understand me, friends who really care about me and care about getting to know who I truly am. So if they don't seem willing to understand me at such a level, after I opened up to them a bit, then it becomes more clear that maybe the "friendship" won't be so close.
I know I hold back a lot because I fear of getting hurt, being misunderstood or made fun of by these "friends"...so once I decided to risk these feelings because that particular friend really seemed "capable" to be there for me...I open up more and be myself more fully. These types of people seem rare though, so it might take time and lots of searching, but don't lose hope.
I feel this comes to a trust issue I may have, I feel my friends already like me for who I am and theres no need to change that perception, similarly whilst Im sure that letting them see a more serious side wouldn't hurt that perception, I just rather they didn't have that opinion of me in their head.
2nd part is definitely interesting. Yea, its like i alrd "customised" myself to each individual/group that changing the image is quite risky..i mean im sure they'll still like me but why should i bother right? Who knows what they're really thinking? "Too emotional/angsty"...thats what i always get when i tweet what i truly feel. Its because everyone has that "im always so happy" perception of me in their heads. Which shocks me everytime i hear it....because im not happy a lot of times.
All boils down to acceptance and trust. Like for example, with XJ i cant be overly emotional about romance or lack thereof becaue how would he react? I wont get the affirmation I need, so why bother making myself feel so vulnerable? None.
Another quirk about me: I don't form extremely close relationships often. Over the course of my life I have had one "best" friend. (Best friend meaning someone I show my whole self to, someone I am completely comfortable with.) I think this might relate to me not being confident enough in myself to let people in. This is not to say I don't have any friends. I have tons of friends, and really good ones that trust me a lot; I just don't give my whole self to them.
About the close friendships thing. I am the same way. I am very picky about who I "let in." I read that ENFJ's tend to hide their "true selves" from people...even though we can share quite a lot. When I read this, I tried to little by little share some secrets with certain friends who I trust more, just to see how they would respond. When they accept these secrets, I feel relieved and feel like my trust in them deepens and that our relationship gets closer. It does feel a little nerve-wracking at first, but when they respond well to it then I think it is really worth it. If they don't respond well, then...I start to question how far the relationship will go. I want friends who can understand me, friends who really care about me and care about getting to know who I truly am. So if they don't seem willing to understand me at such a level, after I opened up to them a bit, then it becomes more clear that maybe the "friendship" won't be so close.
I know I hold back a lot because I fear of getting hurt, being misunderstood or made fun of by these "friends"...so once I decided to risk these feelings because that particular friend really seemed "capable" to be there for me...I open up more and be myself more fully. These types of people seem rare though, so it might take time and lots of searching, but don't lose hope.
I feel this comes to a trust issue I may have, I feel my friends already like me for who I am and theres no need to change that perception, similarly whilst Im sure that letting them see a more serious side wouldn't hurt that perception, I just rather they didn't have that opinion of me in their head.
2nd part is definitely interesting. Yea, its like i alrd "customised" myself to each individual/group that changing the image is quite risky..i mean im sure they'll still like me but why should i bother right? Who knows what they're really thinking? "Too emotional/angsty"...thats what i always get when i tweet what i truly feel. Its because everyone has that "im always so happy" perception of me in their heads. Which shocks me everytime i hear it....because im not happy a lot of times.
All boils down to acceptance and trust. Like for example, with XJ i cant be overly emotional about romance or lack thereof becaue how would he react? I wont get the affirmation I need, so why bother making myself feel so vulnerable? None.
Why ENFJs push people away when they get too close (PART 2)
"I can get so close to someone, offer so much help and the next thing you know, i can withdraw out of their life. I have my reason, let me explain.
Lots of my close friends and relatives are type 4, 5 which are resembling of INFP, INFJ, ISFP...these people have high maintenace and extremely hard to please sometime. They make me walk on egg-shell and are annoyed with everything i say/do. I've been trying my best to bring theme peace of mind, but it seems like they want to torture themselves of all cost. My mother is an INFP and an E4. And im a E3, so i did whatever to seek approval from her. Sometime i got it, sometime not. She's temperament and difficult. I don't blame her, don't take it wrong, she's just being herself."
This. With H (E4) and xj (E5). Yes, again, whatever I did sometimes annoy them and i have to be so guarded so that they wont dislike me or get annoyed. How then do i show my true self? For H, no matter what I said or did, it wouldn't soothe her (for example her SO cheating) and it seems whatever I said was wrong. As much as I wanted to feel needed + help, i'd feel so drained just trying to think of what to say. But again, i dont blame her. Its just the way she is. Its something i have to accept and adjust myself to.
"We are vulnerable and sensitive to rejection. One main reason we keep a distance from people because we are afraid to get hurt. Another is because some of these people drain us deliberately. We are the givers who wear our heart on sleeves. We are the magnets that attract poor wounded souls to us. People can sense our goodness and innocence. But some among these are preditors preying on our energy. So, watch out! Don't let the bad people take advantage of you."
How accurate! Im so afraid to get hurt again. So so so afraid. Its a fear that gets my heart beating so bad at the idea. Brings me back memories i try so hard to supress. Those "black hole" days which scared me to no end. And this paragraph just screams E.
"Ok, my INFPs called me whenever they needed to vent their brain out. I took it all. However, when i tried to call them back sometime, they weren't there. But i found it extraordinary selfish of them."
Yes, at one point of time, I thought this about S. But then i have come to terms with it and i understood it's just because we have high expectations of ourselves. We are always there for others, so we expect the same from others but that's not fair to them. Read an article about INFPs and FI-dom makes everyone's problems invisible because their own problems would be like an unrelenting large cloud of storm at the forefront of their mind.
"One thing it's because of our defense mechanism defense is strong. I do that to let my friends know that i have other special friends too. Maybe we are not that confident as you think we are. We don't want to lean on you and you alone because what if you leave? what are we gonna do? How can we cope? We all have insecurity but we react differently on it, you see?"
too true. I do this a lot to H and sometimes S. But mostly H. Maybe cos i want her to see that I do not belong to her. That i have greater worth? Or that i have better friends, people who that are more similar to me, that im not that weird and different. People that accept me more than her? thats why i'd rather hang out with them? i think its the latter.
Another thing could be we are interested in people from all walks of life. It's a life long study for us ENFJs. We don't really cling to someone you know, everyone is our best friend. That can be good and bad at times. You may find it superficial and pretentious. As my INFP friend said once, i dont have a single circle, it's more like a blop
i totally agreed with him on that. It doesn't mean we forgot you. Different people have different roles in our heart. We will constantly think about you, care about your being..etc. We may or may not say it, but you can feel it by talking to us, look at us in the eyes.
Thats why quality time is so important for me. Showing you that i care, that i want to shower my attention on you and just you for that short period of time. This pretty much sums up being ENFJ.
Advice to all those who want to be 'possessive' of ENFJs:
My advice for you is, don't feel sad about your friend being a social butterfly, don't make her feel guilty and don't hold her back. Let her grow on her own term. She will come back to you eventually. You can never imagine, but if your our special friends, you will stay in the back of our head for life. It may sound strange but it takes almost no time for us to united with you after a long time because in our mind, we never left.
I also find that I initiate a lot in my friendships, organising coffee get-togethers, dinners out etc....that a lot of the time I wish people would call me and ask "Hey, how are you" and listen to me
Yup! I do initiate most of my meet-ups and always the one asking "how are you" question. That i get stunned and shocked when someone asks me"how are you". This agains leads back to being E2 where we have little self-worth and our feelings are of little value. Thus, we ourself dont bother saying how we are, our if so, on a more superficial level. But still, the feeling of wanting to be appreciated is still there.
I agree - all my friends - they each stand on their own in their d
ifferences. They are all unique - different backgrounds, views etc, if I put all my friends in one room I don't think they'd get on lol.
Haha so true. Imagine people that I hang out one-on-one together...Put s, h, yh, e, I in one room. HAHA ok the idea itself is super funny.
As an ENFJ, I think about everyone who's in my life IRL. I even think about the people at PC. I think about my childhood friends who I have never seen again and I wonder what they're doing, how they are. I think about people I worked with years ago and never stayed in contact with. I just cannot stop thinking about PEOPLE.
Yea, interesting idea. Never realised this but this applies to me too. Just yestrday, i was thinking about aisyah, syahida, herlmi, debra, terrance, leon....whuuutttt. haha
"My life is built on personas. If someone gets close they will find out about these personas. Only my closest friends know of my ability to be a chameleon. "
The reason i get so weird when im stuck with 2 close friends who dont know each other....how do i behave? What persona do i put up then?? And im afraid that someone will find out that im different with everyone. It gets hard sometimes having to put up all these personas. Especially after not seeing for so long, i forgot what persona im supposed to put up. And i get scared...what if im too candid? too harsh? too quiet? And the person might find me changed and different...get suspicious and not like me as much? My downfall that will be one day. Why personas? Cos i've "customised" version of myself for everyone. To talk about common topics and shared values to connect and ultimately, be liked and be indispensable. To have that "special" and "unique" connection with someone. A lot of someones, that is. ME in unfamiliar group situations...*dies*. So uncomfortable. I dont know where I stand with them, how to act. That leads me to get close to people one by one in the group. Once i've done my "work" on at least half of the group, only then can i start feeling comfortable and not ostracised or forgotten.
"I do that too(push ppl away)! maybe not at first when it comes to new friends - cos I gotta see if they're trustworthy first, but with close ones I do."
Yes, all down to trust = whether i push you away or not. And yes, i think i'd warn Al or S if i need to run away for a while.
We see people as individuals, whether they are associated with a group/clique or not, and we find at least one person that we absolutely love and want to get to know better in each group. See, ENFJs are very suspicious of groups, though we're accepting of individuals.
Yes. Prime example - KL and YN. Wanting to form my own group (in my head at first and then reality).
When I deliberately pull away
1. I find an interesting new person that I befriend quickly.
2. I realize that I can't possibly maintain the level of intimacy I have created.
3. I back off/run away/ start behaving kind of terse and blunt- not my usual style at all.
When I inadvertently pull away
1. I find an interesting new person that I befriend quickly.
2. I find myself revealing very intimate things about myself and being far too open (which I always do, cannot NOT do, always beat myself up later about, but still do the very next time- every time). 3. I realize that the other person views me as a novelty or a freak and that they don't have any empathy for me- if anything, I have provided them amo and gristle for judgment. They don't understand me. They were not the person I should have been opening up to... This makes me feel embarrassed and saddened and a little mad.
4. I make a vow to be more of a fortress and not to waste more energy on them- which results in me avoiding them or giving clipped answers or whatever until there is more breathing room. This isn't done out of animosity- it is truly self-preservation.
Lots of my close friends and relatives are type 4, 5 which are resembling of INFP, INFJ, ISFP...these people have high maintenace and extremely hard to please sometime. They make me walk on egg-shell and are annoyed with everything i say/do. I've been trying my best to bring theme peace of mind, but it seems like they want to torture themselves of all cost. My mother is an INFP and an E4. And im a E3, so i did whatever to seek approval from her. Sometime i got it, sometime not. She's temperament and difficult. I don't blame her, don't take it wrong, she's just being herself."
This. With H (E4) and xj (E5). Yes, again, whatever I did sometimes annoy them and i have to be so guarded so that they wont dislike me or get annoyed. How then do i show my true self? For H, no matter what I said or did, it wouldn't soothe her (for example her SO cheating) and it seems whatever I said was wrong. As much as I wanted to feel needed + help, i'd feel so drained just trying to think of what to say. But again, i dont blame her. Its just the way she is. Its something i have to accept and adjust myself to.
"We are vulnerable and sensitive to rejection. One main reason we keep a distance from people because we are afraid to get hurt. Another is because some of these people drain us deliberately. We are the givers who wear our heart on sleeves. We are the magnets that attract poor wounded souls to us. People can sense our goodness and innocence. But some among these are preditors preying on our energy. So, watch out! Don't let the bad people take advantage of you."
How accurate! Im so afraid to get hurt again. So so so afraid. Its a fear that gets my heart beating so bad at the idea. Brings me back memories i try so hard to supress. Those "black hole" days which scared me to no end. And this paragraph just screams E.
"Ok, my INFPs called me whenever they needed to vent their brain out. I took it all. However, when i tried to call them back sometime, they weren't there. But i found it extraordinary selfish of them."
Yes, at one point of time, I thought this about S. But then i have come to terms with it and i understood it's just because we have high expectations of ourselves. We are always there for others, so we expect the same from others but that's not fair to them. Read an article about INFPs and FI-dom makes everyone's problems invisible because their own problems would be like an unrelenting large cloud of storm at the forefront of their mind.
"One thing it's because of our defense mechanism defense is strong. I do that to let my friends know that i have other special friends too. Maybe we are not that confident as you think we are. We don't want to lean on you and you alone because what if you leave? what are we gonna do? How can we cope? We all have insecurity but we react differently on it, you see?"
too true. I do this a lot to H and sometimes S. But mostly H. Maybe cos i want her to see that I do not belong to her. That i have greater worth? Or that i have better friends, people who that are more similar to me, that im not that weird and different. People that accept me more than her? thats why i'd rather hang out with them? i think its the latter.
Another thing could be we are interested in people from all walks of life. It's a life long study for us ENFJs. We don't really cling to someone you know, everyone is our best friend. That can be good and bad at times. You may find it superficial and pretentious. As my INFP friend said once, i dont have a single circle, it's more like a blop
i totally agreed with him on that. It doesn't mean we forgot you. Different people have different roles in our heart. We will constantly think about you, care about your being..etc. We may or may not say it, but you can feel it by talking to us, look at us in the eyes. Thats why quality time is so important for me. Showing you that i care, that i want to shower my attention on you and just you for that short period of time. This pretty much sums up being ENFJ.
Advice to all those who want to be 'possessive' of ENFJs:
My advice for you is, don't feel sad about your friend being a social butterfly, don't make her feel guilty and don't hold her back. Let her grow on her own term. She will come back to you eventually. You can never imagine, but if your our special friends, you will stay in the back of our head for life. It may sound strange but it takes almost no time for us to united with you after a long time because in our mind, we never left.
I also find that I initiate a lot in my friendships, organising coffee get-togethers, dinners out etc....that a lot of the time I wish people would call me and ask "Hey, how are you" and listen to me
Yup! I do initiate most of my meet-ups and always the one asking "how are you" question. That i get stunned and shocked when someone asks me"how are you". This agains leads back to being E2 where we have little self-worth and our feelings are of little value. Thus, we ourself dont bother saying how we are, our if so, on a more superficial level. But still, the feeling of wanting to be appreciated is still there.
I agree - all my friends - they each stand on their own in their d
ifferences. They are all unique - different backgrounds, views etc, if I put all my friends in one room I don't think they'd get on lol.
Haha so true. Imagine people that I hang out one-on-one together...Put s, h, yh, e, I in one room. HAHA ok the idea itself is super funny.
As an ENFJ, I think about everyone who's in my life IRL. I even think about the people at PC. I think about my childhood friends who I have never seen again and I wonder what they're doing, how they are. I think about people I worked with years ago and never stayed in contact with. I just cannot stop thinking about PEOPLE.
Yea, interesting idea. Never realised this but this applies to me too. Just yestrday, i was thinking about aisyah, syahida, herlmi, debra, terrance, leon....whuuutttt. haha
"My life is built on personas. If someone gets close they will find out about these personas. Only my closest friends know of my ability to be a chameleon. "
The reason i get so weird when im stuck with 2 close friends who dont know each other....how do i behave? What persona do i put up then?? And im afraid that someone will find out that im different with everyone. It gets hard sometimes having to put up all these personas. Especially after not seeing for so long, i forgot what persona im supposed to put up. And i get scared...what if im too candid? too harsh? too quiet? And the person might find me changed and different...get suspicious and not like me as much? My downfall that will be one day. Why personas? Cos i've "customised" version of myself for everyone. To talk about common topics and shared values to connect and ultimately, be liked and be indispensable. To have that "special" and "unique" connection with someone. A lot of someones, that is. ME in unfamiliar group situations...*dies*. So uncomfortable. I dont know where I stand with them, how to act. That leads me to get close to people one by one in the group. Once i've done my "work" on at least half of the group, only then can i start feeling comfortable and not ostracised or forgotten.
"I do that too(push ppl away)! maybe not at first when it comes to new friends - cos I gotta see if they're trustworthy first, but with close ones I do."
Yes, all down to trust = whether i push you away or not. And yes, i think i'd warn Al or S if i need to run away for a while.
We see people as individuals, whether they are associated with a group/clique or not, and we find at least one person that we absolutely love and want to get to know better in each group. See, ENFJs are very suspicious of groups, though we're accepting of individuals.
Yes. Prime example - KL and YN. Wanting to form my own group (in my head at first and then reality).
When I deliberately pull away
1. I find an interesting new person that I befriend quickly.
2. I realize that I can't possibly maintain the level of intimacy I have created.
3. I back off/run away/ start behaving kind of terse and blunt- not my usual style at all.
When I inadvertently pull away
1. I find an interesting new person that I befriend quickly.
2. I find myself revealing very intimate things about myself and being far too open (which I always do, cannot NOT do, always beat myself up later about, but still do the very next time- every time). 3. I realize that the other person views me as a novelty or a freak and that they don't have any empathy for me- if anything, I have provided them amo and gristle for judgment. They don't understand me. They were not the person I should have been opening up to... This makes me feel embarrassed and saddened and a little mad.
4. I make a vow to be more of a fortress and not to waste more energy on them- which results in me avoiding them or giving clipped answers or whatever until there is more breathing room. This isn't done out of animosity- it is truly self-preservation.
Why ENFJs push people away when they get too close (PART 1)
All my life I've always loved to get to know people, and I get drawn to them. But then there comes a time when that other person responds well to me and gets closer and I feel like they're starting to form an attachment with me....and then I sort of feel nervous and petrified and I back off, keep them at an arm's distance. Then I see them get confused and back off, and then I feel bad and want the relationship to get better again. I'm not just talking about love relationships, I also mean friendships and family relations.
I think this is very true of some of my friendships, particularly H and one point of time, fat. Or when people tag along with me, it makes me wanna just shake them off even tho i may have been the one who initiated the friendship or encouraged them to get attached. Why's that? But this is soooo true for H. I get sooo suffocated and not a v pleasant feeling when she labels me her best friend. But then i feel bad and start trying to be close again but with an extra layer of guardedness? WHY. Ok one theory is that i don't really like some qualities that she has as a person and it gets hard trying to shut up and not say anything about it (goes against my values such as talkingbad abot other people) cos when i do then she gets offended. So it feels like i have to suppress what i think/feel constantly?
For fat or mar, maybe because it's not mutual? or too much hanging out with one person does that to me.
"She always seems to be forcing her way into deeper relationships with people. It's been a thing that actually really annoys me because it makes me wonder why I'm not enough for her.
Sometimes she'll go a week without talking to me because she's so busy trying to be best friends with everybody else. -INFP"
I dont think i'm like that. Im very particular about who i want to be close with. And i'll drop all my friendships for Sya. Simple as that.
"I'm very ankward when friendships get too close. It's like a feeling.. of being uncomfortable.. like pressured, when someone puts a lot of trust and closeness with me.. Not that I don't like it, but it makes me feel a little bit afraid and unwell."
This applies to me, but for certain people only. I think it has some things to do with trust. For example, if KL and i got very close, i would be okay with it simply because i feel safe and know that my secrets would be safe and that I won't be judged for my true flaws and dark thoughts. But H for instance, i do not feel safe because when it comes down to it, i dont trust her. Its her personality, and telling people my stuff which im not okay with. So i think pushing people away has got to do witht the trust aspect. But one bad thing is that we like people, we want to get to know them, but unfortunately its not always a one-way street and sometimes we too have to share abit more about ourselves and our secrets.
"What ENFJ's need to realize is that not every friendship has some sort of hidden agenda. Maybe guys/girls just want to be closer to you because they enjoy your company and not because they want a committed relationship. You're freaking ENFJ's for fuck sake, people love being around you.
If you ENFJ's ever wonder why some people seem to hate you, it's because you're shooting yourselves in the foot. I learned this from my ENFJ mother. you manipulate us without even realizing it. You run away from us when you think you're in danger or have become "too close" to someone and come back when you feel safe again and then repeat that cycle over and over.
To the average person it seems like you are just using us. like you just share your relationship with us when you feel it's convenient and then when higher priorities come up you dump us back down again as if we were never your friends in the first place.
You get our hopes up that maybe we can have a solid relationship with you again only to have you run away again and leave us broken.
You're like the man offering a thousand dollars to a homeless man only to snatch it away and run off as soon as the man reaches for it. sure it's not because you're evil, but it sure as hell seems that way. what else are we supposed to think unless we've studied up on ENFJ's and know how they tick?
And imagine if someone actually did desire a committed relationship from one of you guys. Imagine the trauma that person would undergo even more then with the friendship scenario. I've seen the mental damage someone can go through when they don't know what someone wants because that person keeps emotionally running away for long periods of time with no explanation and then coming back as if they had never left."
Suspicion confirmed =/ I've always wondered if my style of hanging out with friends might come off as just being there cos its convenient. And if so, is that so wrong? And i've once thought that whoever wants to be in a committed relationship with me is gonna go thru hell and back, simply cos i like doing the tango - back and forth. I get scared, can you blame me? We ENFJs feel so deeply, that all sorts of defence mechanism are bound to be there. And running away is one of them. We have such thin psychological boundaries that one move from you can crush us for years.
"ENFJs do the things they do because they have been hurt, or are afraid of being hurt. I'd think you'd understand that it's not always easy to be friends with some people who demand a lot of your time and energy, and you have a need to have a million and one friends, close or otherwise. We're an enigma, yet people figure us out and use it against us, and it'd be wrong to assume after the first few times of it happening, we just LET people get close again, without the fear overtaking our hypersensitive and overemotional bodies and minds and having us run away."
E. He completely messed me up. He figured me out, and played me like a fiddle. Im very guarded now who i let see the true me, not just different facades. I showed E who i really was, and got crushed because he wasn't "charmed" in the slightest, instead i dont know what i was to him. Not again, never again. Thats where the running away part comes in, it's just a defense mechanism.
"I'm afraid of people getting close to me because I have been extremely hurt in the past - my self-esteem and confidence dropped below zero because of 3 people - all at one time (hahah omg same, E +I + N) Although I understand that not everyone out there is going to hurt me it is by way a self-defence mechanism. Sometimes to accept someone is to accept their past, their flaws, and everything else that makes up that person, and bear in mind that someone may have gone through really difficult times and to push/force someone to open up to you way too soon just makes them retreat even more."
This. My self-esteem....what self-esteem? At least it's recovering.
I think this is very true of some of my friendships, particularly H and one point of time, fat. Or when people tag along with me, it makes me wanna just shake them off even tho i may have been the one who initiated the friendship or encouraged them to get attached. Why's that? But this is soooo true for H. I get sooo suffocated and not a v pleasant feeling when she labels me her best friend. But then i feel bad and start trying to be close again but with an extra layer of guardedness? WHY. Ok one theory is that i don't really like some qualities that she has as a person and it gets hard trying to shut up and not say anything about it (goes against my values such as talkingbad abot other people) cos when i do then she gets offended. So it feels like i have to suppress what i think/feel constantly?
For fat or mar, maybe because it's not mutual? or too much hanging out with one person does that to me.
"She always seems to be forcing her way into deeper relationships with people. It's been a thing that actually really annoys me because it makes me wonder why I'm not enough for her.
Sometimes she'll go a week without talking to me because she's so busy trying to be best friends with everybody else. -INFP"
I dont think i'm like that. Im very particular about who i want to be close with. And i'll drop all my friendships for Sya. Simple as that.
"I'm very ankward when friendships get too close. It's like a feeling.. of being uncomfortable.. like pressured, when someone puts a lot of trust and closeness with me.. Not that I don't like it, but it makes me feel a little bit afraid and unwell."
This applies to me, but for certain people only. I think it has some things to do with trust. For example, if KL and i got very close, i would be okay with it simply because i feel safe and know that my secrets would be safe and that I won't be judged for my true flaws and dark thoughts. But H for instance, i do not feel safe because when it comes down to it, i dont trust her. Its her personality, and telling people my stuff which im not okay with. So i think pushing people away has got to do witht the trust aspect. But one bad thing is that we like people, we want to get to know them, but unfortunately its not always a one-way street and sometimes we too have to share abit more about ourselves and our secrets.
"What ENFJ's need to realize is that not every friendship has some sort of hidden agenda. Maybe guys/girls just want to be closer to you because they enjoy your company and not because they want a committed relationship. You're freaking ENFJ's for fuck sake, people love being around you.
If you ENFJ's ever wonder why some people seem to hate you, it's because you're shooting yourselves in the foot. I learned this from my ENFJ mother. you manipulate us without even realizing it. You run away from us when you think you're in danger or have become "too close" to someone and come back when you feel safe again and then repeat that cycle over and over.
To the average person it seems like you are just using us. like you just share your relationship with us when you feel it's convenient and then when higher priorities come up you dump us back down again as if we were never your friends in the first place.
You get our hopes up that maybe we can have a solid relationship with you again only to have you run away again and leave us broken.
You're like the man offering a thousand dollars to a homeless man only to snatch it away and run off as soon as the man reaches for it. sure it's not because you're evil, but it sure as hell seems that way. what else are we supposed to think unless we've studied up on ENFJ's and know how they tick?
And imagine if someone actually did desire a committed relationship from one of you guys. Imagine the trauma that person would undergo even more then with the friendship scenario. I've seen the mental damage someone can go through when they don't know what someone wants because that person keeps emotionally running away for long periods of time with no explanation and then coming back as if they had never left."
Suspicion confirmed =/ I've always wondered if my style of hanging out with friends might come off as just being there cos its convenient. And if so, is that so wrong? And i've once thought that whoever wants to be in a committed relationship with me is gonna go thru hell and back, simply cos i like doing the tango - back and forth. I get scared, can you blame me? We ENFJs feel so deeply, that all sorts of defence mechanism are bound to be there. And running away is one of them. We have such thin psychological boundaries that one move from you can crush us for years.
"ENFJs do the things they do because they have been hurt, or are afraid of being hurt. I'd think you'd understand that it's not always easy to be friends with some people who demand a lot of your time and energy, and you have a need to have a million and one friends, close or otherwise. We're an enigma, yet people figure us out and use it against us, and it'd be wrong to assume after the first few times of it happening, we just LET people get close again, without the fear overtaking our hypersensitive and overemotional bodies and minds and having us run away."
E. He completely messed me up. He figured me out, and played me like a fiddle. Im very guarded now who i let see the true me, not just different facades. I showed E who i really was, and got crushed because he wasn't "charmed" in the slightest, instead i dont know what i was to him. Not again, never again. Thats where the running away part comes in, it's just a defense mechanism.
"I'm afraid of people getting close to me because I have been extremely hurt in the past - my self-esteem and confidence dropped below zero because of 3 people - all at one time (hahah omg same, E +I + N) Although I understand that not everyone out there is going to hurt me it is by way a self-defence mechanism. Sometimes to accept someone is to accept their past, their flaws, and everything else that makes up that person, and bear in mind that someone may have gone through really difficult times and to push/force someone to open up to you way too soon just makes them retreat even more."
This. My self-esteem....what self-esteem? At least it's recovering.
why ENFJs are incredible
Note to self: When you're feeling down or doubting yourself, read this! (from an ENFPs perspective)
Okay, this is long overdue and I really need to 'fess up. I tried post a different thread to you but I think what I was trying to say was in it's feeble stages. What I really want to convey is how grateful I am that ENFJs are in the world. ENFJs are absolutely wonderful people and I'm not sure you know your gifts to those around you. I think you have an "idea" but I think you like things "confirmed" by others. So here it is. Forewarning: I am very emotional and honest about this so expect this to be a long post.
I think I am more than qualified to boast about ENFJs' sensational qualities. After testing for type, all six of my very closest (physical real life) friends are ENFJs. These are males and females. Plus, the father of my child (marriage lasted 8 years) with whom I still remain friends is also an ENFJ. If it wasn't for the ENFJ, I honestly don't know how I would make it through my life.
Do you know how beautiful and how charming you are? Do you know that wherever I may go, a party or whatever, you manage to find me and approach me? You extend your hand to me in friendship and love. You take risks at being my friend and you are so loyal to me once you do. You see the good in me when I don't see it in myself.
You have such strength. You go through your life and see the good in others. Yes, sometimes you get hurt and don't understand why there wasn't "that connection" because you felt it so deeply on your end. All I can say is that "I'm sorry". And you've wasted your time on many people that were not even worthy of you. That is usually when you call me and I will listen forever. I will listen to all the pain you are suffering or have suffered. I will help you see things "in a different way" so that you can feel good about yourself again. I have absolutely no problem doing this. That is finally my chance to love you back.
It's so sweet. You always want to make sure you're doing "the right thing", that you did it "nobly". You love to "report" to me how you handled different situations. I love hearing it. We encourage each other, right? I will always validate you that you did something right. This is not because I'm into blowing smoke up your ass. This is because the reality is : You care about others and "doing the right thing" WAY more than most people on this planet. You have a good heart. I help you to trust in that. I want you to trust in yourself and to be able to need validation only from yourself.
You know you're physically gorgeous, right? I mean I know you are HOPING that you are. It's scary to reveal your insecurities. But you can relax. The reality and truth is: You ARE gorgeous. It doesn't matter when you get too skinny, too fat, too young or too old. There is a beauty you posses that will always be. Trust me, I've seen it. My ENFJ friends ages range from 21 to 56, I've seen you all through many stages and you ALL remain gorgeous. Do you ever age? Lol.
It's okay to have this wonderful "physical gift". Who is it better bestowed upon than persons who equally match that with their insides as well. You know you confuse people, right? You are so attractive, so intelligent, you are so open, AND THEN what you give emotionally!!!!!!! Do you know how that blows people's minds??
There is no other personality that is better suited for me when it comes to friendship, contact, and communication. We both can call each other at any odd time of the day. We both don't get offended if one of us has to 'go' all of a sudden. We just "get" each other. We can go long stretches without speaking to each other. We both know what that's about. We are both extraverted and have our hands in "lots of pies." We both get "busy", but then when one of us calls the other and we finally make "contact", we can talk for hours and quickly go to an emotionally deep level as if we've never left each other's side.
You ENFJs keep me "in line". No, it's not by you demanding it. I stay in "line" because I am inspired by your efficiency in this world. You have this fine balance of "taking care of business" and "loving those around you." In fact, you're AMAZING at this capability. You are wonderful, loving role-models. When I want to give up and do nothing, you show me how I can undertake EVERYTHING. When I want to turn around and throw a tantrum at the person who just hurt me, you show me how to convey the message more appropriately. Lol- THAT is your biggest gift to me. But I guess I tend to do the same for you. It's just easier giving the appropriate advice when you're not the one being hurt I guess. Why do we feel such a symbiosis with each other?
For some reason, you all ask my advice. Do you know how much of a self-esteem booster that is for me? People that I think have it together WAY more than I do, seem to crave my every word. And then when I give it, you love me for it. You're so sweet. I think you understand that I need to give too.
I know it's hard for you to ask for compliments. You are ALWAYS complimenting me. But it is so charming to see how I can turn your day around when I give you compliments. No, my compliments are not "fluff". You really deserve what I tell you. And you look and sound so wonderful receiving compliments. I don't know a better group of people to bestow compliments upon. You become so honest, so child-like. A big smile spreads across your face. You give hugs with a resounding "Thank you". You always manage to express thoughtful appreciation.
My ENFJ friends have all been "aunts" "uncle" and of course "father" to my daughter. Even though I've cut out extended family, my child has a full "family" because of you.
Thank you ENFJs. You have inspired me to no end. I owe much of what I am today to you because you believed in me when I had no idea there was even a seed of worthiness within. Thank you for always "being there" when I lock my keys in my car. Thank you for helping me with planning. THANK YOU FOR BELIEVING IN ME. Thank you for taking the time to explain.
You are wonderful people. You glow and your are a beacon. I rarely have negative incidences with you. Even when I have become frustrated with an ENFJ, it can't last that long. Because in just a short amount of time you manage to do something amazing again.
Seriously, other divorced people drop their jaw when they witness the caring and cordial relationship between me and my ex husband. But neither one of us is good at being "mean" anyway. So we laugh at the world in all their "meanness."
ENFJ, No one understands me like you do. And I ALWAYS feel accepted by you. Please love yourselves dearly ENFJs. Your kind of love saves people's lives. I mean it.
Okay, this is long overdue and I really need to 'fess up. I tried post a different thread to you but I think what I was trying to say was in it's feeble stages. What I really want to convey is how grateful I am that ENFJs are in the world. ENFJs are absolutely wonderful people and I'm not sure you know your gifts to those around you. I think you have an "idea" but I think you like things "confirmed" by others. So here it is. Forewarning: I am very emotional and honest about this so expect this to be a long post.
I think I am more than qualified to boast about ENFJs' sensational qualities. After testing for type, all six of my very closest (physical real life) friends are ENFJs. These are males and females. Plus, the father of my child (marriage lasted 8 years) with whom I still remain friends is also an ENFJ. If it wasn't for the ENFJ, I honestly don't know how I would make it through my life.
Do you know how beautiful and how charming you are? Do you know that wherever I may go, a party or whatever, you manage to find me and approach me? You extend your hand to me in friendship and love. You take risks at being my friend and you are so loyal to me once you do. You see the good in me when I don't see it in myself.
You have such strength. You go through your life and see the good in others. Yes, sometimes you get hurt and don't understand why there wasn't "that connection" because you felt it so deeply on your end. All I can say is that "I'm sorry". And you've wasted your time on many people that were not even worthy of you. That is usually when you call me and I will listen forever. I will listen to all the pain you are suffering or have suffered. I will help you see things "in a different way" so that you can feel good about yourself again. I have absolutely no problem doing this. That is finally my chance to love you back.
It's so sweet. You always want to make sure you're doing "the right thing", that you did it "nobly". You love to "report" to me how you handled different situations. I love hearing it. We encourage each other, right? I will always validate you that you did something right. This is not because I'm into blowing smoke up your ass. This is because the reality is : You care about others and "doing the right thing" WAY more than most people on this planet. You have a good heart. I help you to trust in that. I want you to trust in yourself and to be able to need validation only from yourself.
You know you're physically gorgeous, right? I mean I know you are HOPING that you are. It's scary to reveal your insecurities. But you can relax. The reality and truth is: You ARE gorgeous. It doesn't matter when you get too skinny, too fat, too young or too old. There is a beauty you posses that will always be. Trust me, I've seen it. My ENFJ friends ages range from 21 to 56, I've seen you all through many stages and you ALL remain gorgeous. Do you ever age? Lol.
It's okay to have this wonderful "physical gift". Who is it better bestowed upon than persons who equally match that with their insides as well. You know you confuse people, right? You are so attractive, so intelligent, you are so open, AND THEN what you give emotionally!!!!!!! Do you know how that blows people's minds??
There is no other personality that is better suited for me when it comes to friendship, contact, and communication. We both can call each other at any odd time of the day. We both don't get offended if one of us has to 'go' all of a sudden. We just "get" each other. We can go long stretches without speaking to each other. We both know what that's about. We are both extraverted and have our hands in "lots of pies." We both get "busy", but then when one of us calls the other and we finally make "contact", we can talk for hours and quickly go to an emotionally deep level as if we've never left each other's side.
You ENFJs keep me "in line". No, it's not by you demanding it. I stay in "line" because I am inspired by your efficiency in this world. You have this fine balance of "taking care of business" and "loving those around you." In fact, you're AMAZING at this capability. You are wonderful, loving role-models. When I want to give up and do nothing, you show me how I can undertake EVERYTHING. When I want to turn around and throw a tantrum at the person who just hurt me, you show me how to convey the message more appropriately. Lol- THAT is your biggest gift to me. But I guess I tend to do the same for you. It's just easier giving the appropriate advice when you're not the one being hurt I guess. Why do we feel such a symbiosis with each other?
For some reason, you all ask my advice. Do you know how much of a self-esteem booster that is for me? People that I think have it together WAY more than I do, seem to crave my every word. And then when I give it, you love me for it. You're so sweet. I think you understand that I need to give too.
I know it's hard for you to ask for compliments. You are ALWAYS complimenting me. But it is so charming to see how I can turn your day around when I give you compliments. No, my compliments are not "fluff". You really deserve what I tell you. And you look and sound so wonderful receiving compliments. I don't know a better group of people to bestow compliments upon. You become so honest, so child-like. A big smile spreads across your face. You give hugs with a resounding "Thank you". You always manage to express thoughtful appreciation.
My ENFJ friends have all been "aunts" "uncle" and of course "father" to my daughter. Even though I've cut out extended family, my child has a full "family" because of you.
Thank you ENFJs. You have inspired me to no end. I owe much of what I am today to you because you believed in me when I had no idea there was even a seed of worthiness within. Thank you for always "being there" when I lock my keys in my car. Thank you for helping me with planning. THANK YOU FOR BELIEVING IN ME. Thank you for taking the time to explain.
You are wonderful people. You glow and your are a beacon. I rarely have negative incidences with you. Even when I have become frustrated with an ENFJ, it can't last that long. Because in just a short amount of time you manage to do something amazing again.
Seriously, other divorced people drop their jaw when they witness the caring and cordial relationship between me and my ex husband. But neither one of us is good at being "mean" anyway. So we laugh at the world in all their "meanness."
ENFJ, No one understands me like you do. And I ALWAYS feel accepted by you. Please love yourselves dearly ENFJs. Your kind of love saves people's lives. I mean it.
Tuesday, May 8, 2012
Differences btwn ENFJ and INFJ
I'm a fairly balanced ENFJ with a strong Fe as well as a strong Ni - which basically translates to me being happy both introverted and introspecting, or extroverted and gregarious.
How Fe allows a person to become extroverted is that no matter what the situation is, how dire, or how draining, the Fe-user has an inherent pull to engage the other person. At the same time, engaging other people adds to our energy - i.e. the more we engage the other person, the more energized we get.
Practically, one of the biggest differences between ENFJ's and INFJ's is the amount and use of this energy. ENFJ's are not uncommonly likened to a perpetual energy drink. The more we get of people, the more we want of them.
My experience with the ENFJ energy
- One of the biggest noticeable difference b/w ENFJ's and INFJ's not by looking at how we socialize, because the functions pretty much hold most of our socialization methods constant [with respect to judgement of people, using instincts to read people, helping them etc] ... but how much we socialize. INFJ's though can be outspoken, able to lead in certain group situations will eventually tire of extended social contact. Whereas, the ENFJ will continue to go. We interact in much the same way as INFJ's ... it's just that we interact with more and more people given the opportunity and for longer hours.
- With positive interactions [it's important to note this because our energy drains in negative interactions], ENFJ's continue to maintain a strong level of energy before, during and after the interaction. Even though we are planners and love to go by the appointment book, we are a little more inclined than INFJ's to be spontaneous and engage in impulsive plan-making. We can normally switch between spontaneity and planning depending on the situation being perfectly happy in either scenario - as long as the end result allows us to engage our Fe with respect to pleasing people.
The Key Difference in Relationship Management
- Being social animals, ENFJ's actually have very defined standards of maintaining relationships. It can be broken down into a science. Sometimes, we make many friends depending on mutual fulfilment of needs. E.g. If there is a certain interest that I have in a particular trade / craft / science, then I would actively seek the friendship of the person that is involved in that trade so that I can get as much information about that craft straight from the horse's mouth.
This may seem a little selfish - however, how Fe works in this scenario is that we prefer to offer our help / service to the other person with their trade / craft in order to become friends. It becomes a symbiotic friendship. We repeat the same process with other individuals till we reach a point where all of our own needs are being met through our social interactions - and also our own need to give is being met by allowing us to do favours to the person we're involved with <-- this is actually our most preferred mode of behaviour.
Like the INFJ's, ENFJ's are also drawn towards the down-trodden underdog. We have a strong need to provide some sort of a service to the ailing individual [for ENFJ males, the Damsel in Distress is the ultimate temptress]. The difference is that INFJ's would be more inclined to talk the person through their problems whereas ENFJ's would be more inclined to invite the person for an intimate walk, an engaging phone-call, a coffee 'date'. Also, the difference is in how much we can engage the other person. If the other person really needs, we can engage them for a full 10-15 hours before feeling ourselves getting worn down.
Now imagine the above and trying to do that as an INFJ for about 5-10 people at the same time. That would be I think one of the key differences. ENFJ's are more inclined to take more people on as projects then INFJ's would.
We have a very keen memory [when it comes to people's problems - not day-to-day routine things] and also the ability to compartmentalize our feelings for different individuals.
Are ENFJ's as Committed as INFJ's?
One of the most common questions I've seen is that just because people see the ENFJ as a social animal, they immediately assume that an ENFJ would probably be an emotional, or a physical cheat. That is interestingly not the case. An ENFJ, though extremely social is very unlikely to cheat on their SO's. One of the reasons for this is that our Fe is at it's max when thinking about the SO --- therefore no other individual gets the same priority. Even when feelings start developing --- we get an immediate warning from within that forces us to realize that we may be erring and could potentially be causing harm to our SO - therefore even though we have many friends to fulfil some of our emotional needs, we don't let them get to a point where those friends would "replace" the value of our SO.
Do ENFJ's have deep thoughts about saving the world like INFJ's?
Another question that comes up frequently is whether ENFJ's are capable of using Ni the same way as INFJ's to have deep thoughts about the world or not? ... and the answer is yes ... ENFJ's are very much the same in their use of Fe Ni as the INFJ's --- the difference comes in that INFJ's are more likely to be literary authors of the revolutionary statement whereas the ENFJ would be the most likely person to carry the message to the people. A classic example of a saviour ENFJ is Martin Luther King.
Are ENFJ's Introverted?
Depending on the development of the Ni and the balance with Fe, ENFJ's can be just as introverted as INFJ's or INTJ's. Because we maintain such a large network of friends and social friendships [most of which are based on us being the service providers] we have to retreat into ourselves for long periods in order to engage Ti [which is traditionally our weakest function]. At times it takes us 1-2 days or even weeks to analyze a logical situation and come up with an appropriate response to a social dilemma. And in that time, we retreat from the world. Because of this need to mull over social situations, ENFJ's are considered to be one of the most introverted of the extroverted types.
Individuals with an equally developed Ni and Fe can be happy both alone as well as around people
Individuals with a less developed Ni can only be alone for a certain amount of time before needing social contact.
The biggest difference?
The biggest difference between an INFJ and ENFJ imo is pretty much the number of social relationships welike to have. There's never really an "enough is enough" attitude for an ENFJ until and unless those particular social interactions start draining on our emotional reserves. Even then we don't actually door-slam people - being Fe-dom doesn't allow it. Our door-slam is a begrudging one i.e. we accept if another person wants to door-slam us ... but our doors remain open.
Thoese were some of the key differences I've noticed based on myself and interactions with other ENFJ's [the ones that I can think of right now - I'll keep adding more as I see them]. If there are more questions, I'll be happy to answer. And if you guys have differences between INFJ's and ENFJ's, please feel free to post.
How Fe allows a person to become extroverted is that no matter what the situation is, how dire, or how draining, the Fe-user has an inherent pull to engage the other person. At the same time, engaging other people adds to our energy - i.e. the more we engage the other person, the more energized we get.
Practically, one of the biggest differences between ENFJ's and INFJ's is the amount and use of this energy. ENFJ's are not uncommonly likened to a perpetual energy drink. The more we get of people, the more we want of them.
My experience with the ENFJ energy
- One of the biggest noticeable difference b/w ENFJ's and INFJ's not by looking at how we socialize, because the functions pretty much hold most of our socialization methods constant [with respect to judgement of people, using instincts to read people, helping them etc] ... but how much we socialize. INFJ's though can be outspoken, able to lead in certain group situations will eventually tire of extended social contact. Whereas, the ENFJ will continue to go. We interact in much the same way as INFJ's ... it's just that we interact with more and more people given the opportunity and for longer hours.
- With positive interactions [it's important to note this because our energy drains in negative interactions], ENFJ's continue to maintain a strong level of energy before, during and after the interaction. Even though we are planners and love to go by the appointment book, we are a little more inclined than INFJ's to be spontaneous and engage in impulsive plan-making. We can normally switch between spontaneity and planning depending on the situation being perfectly happy in either scenario - as long as the end result allows us to engage our Fe with respect to pleasing people.
The Key Difference in Relationship Management
- Being social animals, ENFJ's actually have very defined standards of maintaining relationships. It can be broken down into a science. Sometimes, we make many friends depending on mutual fulfilment of needs. E.g. If there is a certain interest that I have in a particular trade / craft / science, then I would actively seek the friendship of the person that is involved in that trade so that I can get as much information about that craft straight from the horse's mouth.
This may seem a little selfish - however, how Fe works in this scenario is that we prefer to offer our help / service to the other person with their trade / craft in order to become friends. It becomes a symbiotic friendship. We repeat the same process with other individuals till we reach a point where all of our own needs are being met through our social interactions - and also our own need to give is being met by allowing us to do favours to the person we're involved with <-- this is actually our most preferred mode of behaviour.
Like the INFJ's, ENFJ's are also drawn towards the down-trodden underdog. We have a strong need to provide some sort of a service to the ailing individual [for ENFJ males, the Damsel in Distress is the ultimate temptress]. The difference is that INFJ's would be more inclined to talk the person through their problems whereas ENFJ's would be more inclined to invite the person for an intimate walk, an engaging phone-call, a coffee 'date'. Also, the difference is in how much we can engage the other person. If the other person really needs, we can engage them for a full 10-15 hours before feeling ourselves getting worn down.
Now imagine the above and trying to do that as an INFJ for about 5-10 people at the same time. That would be I think one of the key differences. ENFJ's are more inclined to take more people on as projects then INFJ's would.
We have a very keen memory [when it comes to people's problems - not day-to-day routine things] and also the ability to compartmentalize our feelings for different individuals.
Are ENFJ's as Committed as INFJ's?
One of the most common questions I've seen is that just because people see the ENFJ as a social animal, they immediately assume that an ENFJ would probably be an emotional, or a physical cheat. That is interestingly not the case. An ENFJ, though extremely social is very unlikely to cheat on their SO's. One of the reasons for this is that our Fe is at it's max when thinking about the SO --- therefore no other individual gets the same priority. Even when feelings start developing --- we get an immediate warning from within that forces us to realize that we may be erring and could potentially be causing harm to our SO - therefore even though we have many friends to fulfil some of our emotional needs, we don't let them get to a point where those friends would "replace" the value of our SO.
Do ENFJ's have deep thoughts about saving the world like INFJ's?
Another question that comes up frequently is whether ENFJ's are capable of using Ni the same way as INFJ's to have deep thoughts about the world or not? ... and the answer is yes ... ENFJ's are very much the same in their use of Fe Ni as the INFJ's --- the difference comes in that INFJ's are more likely to be literary authors of the revolutionary statement whereas the ENFJ would be the most likely person to carry the message to the people. A classic example of a saviour ENFJ is Martin Luther King.
Are ENFJ's Introverted?
Depending on the development of the Ni and the balance with Fe, ENFJ's can be just as introverted as INFJ's or INTJ's. Because we maintain such a large network of friends and social friendships [most of which are based on us being the service providers] we have to retreat into ourselves for long periods in order to engage Ti [which is traditionally our weakest function]. At times it takes us 1-2 days or even weeks to analyze a logical situation and come up with an appropriate response to a social dilemma. And in that time, we retreat from the world. Because of this need to mull over social situations, ENFJ's are considered to be one of the most introverted of the extroverted types.
Individuals with an equally developed Ni and Fe can be happy both alone as well as around people
Individuals with a less developed Ni can only be alone for a certain amount of time before needing social contact.
The biggest difference?
The biggest difference between an INFJ and ENFJ imo is pretty much the number of social relationships welike to have. There's never really an "enough is enough" attitude for an ENFJ until and unless those particular social interactions start draining on our emotional reserves. Even then we don't actually door-slam people - being Fe-dom doesn't allow it. Our door-slam is a begrudging one i.e. we accept if another person wants to door-slam us ... but our doors remain open.
Thoese were some of the key differences I've noticed based on myself and interactions with other ENFJ's [the ones that I can think of right now - I'll keep adding more as I see them]. If there are more questions, I'll be happy to answer. And if you guys have differences between INFJ's and ENFJ's, please feel free to post.
Description - ENFJs ("Pedagogues" of humanity)
ENFJs are the benevolent ‘pedagogues’ of humanity. They have tremendous charisma by which many are drawn into their nurturant tutelage and/or grand schemes. Many ENFJs have tremendous power to manipulate others with their phenomenal interpersonal skills and unique salesmanship. But it’s usually not meant as manipulation — ENFJs generally believe in their dreams, and see themselves as helpers and enablers, which they usually are.
ENFJs are global learners. They see the big picture. The ENFJs focus is expansive. Some can juggle an amazing number of responsibilities or projects simultaneously. Many ENFJs have tremendous entrepreneurial ability.
ENFJs are, by definition, Js, with whom we associate organization and decisiveness. But they don’t resemble the SJs or even the NTJs in organization of the environment nor occasional recalcitrance. ENFJs are organized in the arena of interpersonal affairs. Their offices may or may not be cluttered, but their conclusions (reached through feelings) about people and motives are drawn much more quickly and are more resilient than those of their NFP counterparts.
ENFJs know and appreciate people. Like most NFs, (and Feelers in general), they are apt to neglect themselves and their own needs for the needs of others. They have thinner psychological boundaries than most, and are at risk for being hurt or even abused by less sensitive people. ENFJs often take on more of the burdens of others than they can bear.
TRADEMARK: “The first shall be last”
This refers to the open-door policy of ENFJs. One ENFJ colleague always welcomes me into his office regardless of his own circumstances. If another person comes to the door, he allows them to interrupt our conversation with their need. While discussing that need, the phone rings and he stops to answer it. Others drop in with a ‘quick question.’ I finally get up, go to my office and use the call waiting feature on the telephone. When he hangs up, I have his undivided attention!
Extraverted Feeling
Extraverted Feeling rules the ENFJ’s psyche. In the sway of this rational function, these folks are predisposed to closure in matters pertaining to people, and especially on behalf of their beloved. As extraverts, their contacts are wide ranging. Face-to-face relationships are intense, personable and warm, though they may be so infrequently achieved that intimate friendships are rare.
Introverted iNtuition
Like their INFJ cousins, ENFJs are blessed through introverted intuition with clarity of perception in the inner, unconscious world. Dominant Feeling prefers to find the silver lining in even the most beggarly perceptions of those in their expanding circle of friends and, of course, in themselves. In less balanced individuals, such mitigation of the unseemly eventually undermines the ENFJ’s integrity and frequently their good name. In healthier individuals, deft use of this awareness of the inner needs and desires of others enables this astute type to win friends, influence people, and avoid compromising entanglements.
The dynamic nature of their intuition moves ENFJs from one project to another with the assurance that the next one will be perfect, or much more nearly so than the last. ENFJs are continually looking for newer and better solutions to benefit their extensive family, staff, or organization.
Extraverted Sensing
Sensing is extraverted. ENFJs can manage details, particularly those necessary to implement the prevailing vision. These data have, however, a magical flexible quality. Something to be bought can be had for a song; the same something is invaluable when it’s time to sell. (We are not certain, but we suspect that such is the influence of the primary function.) This wavering of sensory perception is made possible by the weaker and less mature status with which the tertiary is endowed.
Introverted Thinking
Introverted Thinking is least apparent and most enigmatic in this type. In fact, it often appears only when summoned by Feeling. At times only in jest, but in earnest if need be, Thinking entertains as logical only those conclusions which support Feeling’s values. Other scenarios can be shown invalid or at best significantly inferior. Such “Thinking in the service of Feeling” has the appearance of logic, but somehow it never quite adds up.
Extroverted Feeling
An explanation of Extroverted Feeling (Fe).
This is my personal definition of Fe, which I want to share impressions and results. To start, let's define what Feeling itself is.
What is Feeling?
Feeling is a judging function which judges and makes decisions based on a desire of harmony between the Fe user, the beings that live there and the location. To feel that the environment is well taken, understanding and respecting all personal wishes and other's wishes is very important for a Feeler.
Because of this need of harmony, Feelers like to identify and follow a chosen set of values, principles, codes of conduct and rules and guide the Fe user to an appropiate behavior in the determined situation, so it enables harmony. This does not mean that a Feeler agrees and submissively everything that it is imposed to them as appropiate or good for establishing harmony. Feelers will consider and evaluate it. A Feeler can be very confrontational and opposing as well as fight people, groups and situations because it will not help to establish the desired harmonious environment.
The nature of this function is very subjective, if we define subjectivity as something related to the subject. Feelers like to know people's POV and how it affects and it is affected by the environment. This can also include animals, plants, etc, how they are affected and how they affect the enviornment.
What is Extroverted Feeling?
Extroverted Feeling (Fe) has its origin in everything that happens outside the self, which are people, places, objects, systems, values, thoughts, actions, etc. Therefore Fe is the judging function that judges and takes decisions in base on an analysis of principles, values, systems, and thoughts that people and the Fe user hold on a determined environment.
Fe also considers the own Fe user's position, the effect they have on their locality and how locality affects them, which makes them measure how positive or negative would a determined action of the Fe user is as well as how to put personal interests (that vary greatly from person) in action with Fe.
Which things are important for someone who decides using Fe?
It varies greatly. Depends on the Fe user, their environment, background and upbringing. We can't stablish a general set of things that are important for a Fe user, because its subjective nature makes it hard to.
For example, a kid with dominant Fe was taught in his house to value efficiency, success, tough competition, an aggressive and strong approach. Selflessness and friendship were secondary, even inferior and despised to this Fe kid. When this kid has grown up, he would behave cruelly, unrespectfully and harshly in front of people who percieves them as weak, losers or not so strong-willed and the Fe user will impose them subtely and directly to be like the Fe user. These valued things, taught in childhood, are put into practice in their localities so it brings what it is thought as harmonious for a good social and environmental (not in an ecological sense this time) setting.
To be a dom/aux Fe does not mean to lack personal interests, wishes and personal POVs which are wanted to be follow by the Fe user and others. But it means that they will find the best way to stablish harmony in their environment and people, being the "best way" something that varies a lot from people.
However, there are three important things that a Fe user likes to consider when using Fe. These are explained in the most outached way as possible.
a) Social Roles
Fe users like to know everyone's social roles and how these affect a determined situation. For example, a Fe user may see a secretary to be very distinct from a boss, as they have different qualities, good and bad as well as different ambitions. They will find the best way (again, it varies greatly) to deal with them and stablish the desired link to relate to both of them.
b) Group Affinity
In every situation, a Fe user will find how a person or social group works, what they support and stand against, and accordingly to the Fe user's judgement, will seek afiliation to them, to their values, thoughts and activites. Maybe this is why Fe doms are thought to be very gregarious and sociable individuals. Fe users can very well fight and stand against other people and groups which don't support what the Fe user support.
c) Social gestures/graces and communication
Courtesy, prudence, humor, thankfulness or sensitivity can be perceived as important to a Fe user because it makes easier to stablish an understanding of a person's personal situations and how they are affected. Unthankfulness, rudeness, coldness, disagreeableness and lack of respect can also be taken into account by a Fe user because it helps to make clear the unapproval of a person, situation, etc. It also helps to respond to said and unsaid needs as well to make them know our agreement or disagreement.
Some traits associated with Fe and my explanation of them.
a) Emotional sensitivity
Although it looks like, Fe does not guarantee a developed emotional senstivity or a deeper connection with your feelings. It is however associated because of the subjective nature of this function, which seeks an understanding of people, personal data and the environment. You can be an unsensitive and utilitarian manipulator who uses Fe to follow your selfish interests establishing harmonious environments which misguide people.
b) Empathy
Empathy is the capacity to recognize other's emotional states and the circumstances that provoke it. A Fe user is not necesarilly empathetic, because emotional states aren't necessarily the main factor for making decisions, they may have other criteria like usefulness or integrity on other people. But Fe can help to develop empathy, because the social interaction that accompanies Fe can train you into recognizing emotional states.
c) Compassion
Compassion is the emotional state that arises from another being's suffering, and motivate us to help them to overcome the things that causes suffering to the other being. Compassion can also be taught through Fe, for the same reasons mentioned with empathy, but it's not a guaranteed trai
Being a pushover and shallow
They say ENFJs are such pushovers cos we are Fe-doms and we respect other people's feelings and opinions too much such that in our minds, our own feelings and opinions are not as important.
They say ENFJs are shallow. We want to be accepted and care what others think about us because we want harmony and other's opinions matter so much more than our own (back to the point of respecting others feelings and opinions too much...)
They say ENFJs are shallow. We want to be accepted and care what others think about us because we want harmony and other's opinions matter so much more than our own (back to the point of respecting others feelings and opinions too much...)
What I am?
I often challenge myself to learning things (sometimes that others think I can't do) or set very high goals for myself
I sometimes go out of my way to help people (though I don't think they realize it)
I am often obsessed with various TV-shows or actors or whatnot
I am very competitive
I am easily hurt, and will dwell upon these feelings and analyse them
I am unable to let go of hurtful feelings - I will bring them up again as soon as something similar happens
I act introvert around extroverts and extrovert around introverts or close friends
I am often called weird
I want my friends to text me or chat with me on Skype but I am annoyed when they do
I am a perfectionist but not detail-oriented
I will research or nurture my newest interest for hours at end
I flee from responsibilities yet I feel bored without them
I hate it when someone overestimates their own ability and becomes arrogant
I believe that everyone are good at their core; I dislike the black and white-view. I can't bring myself to think that anyone are behaving badly for its own sake.
I can't stand it when my friends laugh at someone behind their back, just as much as I don't want to be laughed at myself
I will only act according to the normal social rules among people I don't know well and authorities - otherwise I follow my own set of rules that I have noticed to be a bit unique
I believe in action rather than words
I am very lazy, but hard-working once I get started
I never miss a deadline set by an authority; I often miss deadlines set by myself or friends
Most of my ideas just stay in my head
I seek out strong feelings - usually love or sadness
I see everything that could go wrong
I will express strong negative feelings by jokingly complaining about whatever caused them
I feel better having one very close friend than lots of "shallow" friends
I am practical
I love to analyse behaviours
While I had no problem spending 3 weeks constantly in the company of my best friend, I will tire of hanging out in my group of friends within a few hours
I usually say something general, then give an example to clarify
I am very empathetic
I prefer to learn by trial and error, unless it's at work or something similar
I want to know the reasons
I often buy, bring or do things "just in case"
I can quite easily grasp general concepts
I have a horribly detail memory
I like to plan what I want to do, but I don't have to follow my plans
I am very bad at everyday life maintenance, but I am almost obsessive-compulsive with my computer keyboard being clean (my friends seem to find this funny)
I often catch myself buying stuff just because I want them, without really planning to do anything with them (mostly books)
I keep things even if they are of no use to me. I am very careful with all of my possessions - I don't really like the thought of breaking them through excessive use.
I fear..:
Realizing who I thought was my friend actually doesn't like me at all
Not living up to expectations
Never being anyone's first choice of company
Overestimating my own abilities
To be misunderstood
Being laughed at
I want..:
To be seen as kind and deep/hard to understand
To be understood
To impress with skills and niceness
To be seen as humble
To be truly helpful to the emotional well-being of friends
To be able to, without fear, be myself with one person
To be seen as authentic
To be accepting
To be interesting
To do things well
I need..:
Reassurance that I'm liked
To have time for myself
Something to obsess over
To have someone who is very close to me
My friends have called me:
Kind
Selfish
Cute
Weird
Good at everything
Annoying
Smart
Quiet
I sometimes go out of my way to help people (though I don't think they realize it)
I am often obsessed with various TV-shows or actors or whatnot
I am very competitive
I am easily hurt, and will dwell upon these feelings and analyse them
I am unable to let go of hurtful feelings - I will bring them up again as soon as something similar happens
I act introvert around extroverts and extrovert around introverts or close friends
I am often called weird
I want my friends to text me or chat with me on Skype but I am annoyed when they do
I am a perfectionist but not detail-oriented
I will research or nurture my newest interest for hours at end
I flee from responsibilities yet I feel bored without them
I hate it when someone overestimates their own ability and becomes arrogant
I believe that everyone are good at their core; I dislike the black and white-view. I can't bring myself to think that anyone are behaving badly for its own sake.
I can't stand it when my friends laugh at someone behind their back, just as much as I don't want to be laughed at myself
I will only act according to the normal social rules among people I don't know well and authorities - otherwise I follow my own set of rules that I have noticed to be a bit unique
I believe in action rather than words
I am very lazy, but hard-working once I get started
I never miss a deadline set by an authority; I often miss deadlines set by myself or friends
Most of my ideas just stay in my head
I seek out strong feelings - usually love or sadness
I see everything that could go wrong
I will express strong negative feelings by jokingly complaining about whatever caused them
I feel better having one very close friend than lots of "shallow" friends
I am practical
I love to analyse behaviours
While I had no problem spending 3 weeks constantly in the company of my best friend, I will tire of hanging out in my group of friends within a few hours
I usually say something general, then give an example to clarify
I am very empathetic
I prefer to learn by trial and error, unless it's at work or something similar
I want to know the reasons
I often buy, bring or do things "just in case"
I can quite easily grasp general concepts
I have a horribly detail memory
I like to plan what I want to do, but I don't have to follow my plans
I am very bad at everyday life maintenance, but I am almost obsessive-compulsive with my computer keyboard being clean (my friends seem to find this funny)
I often catch myself buying stuff just because I want them, without really planning to do anything with them (mostly books)
I keep things even if they are of no use to me. I am very careful with all of my possessions - I don't really like the thought of breaking them through excessive use.
I fear..:
Realizing who I thought was my friend actually doesn't like me at all
Not living up to expectations
Never being anyone's first choice of company
Overestimating my own abilities
To be misunderstood
Being laughed at
I want..:
To be seen as kind and deep/hard to understand
To be understood
To impress with skills and niceness
To be seen as humble
To be truly helpful to the emotional well-being of friends
To be able to, without fear, be myself with one person
To be seen as authentic
To be accepting
To be interesting
To do things well
I need..:
Reassurance that I'm liked
To have time for myself
Something to obsess over
To have someone who is very close to me
My friends have called me:
Kind
Selfish
Cute
Weird
Good at everything
Annoying
Smart
Quiet
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